Paso 750 handling - can anyone describe it to me?

[Graemer57]

Thanks for the feedback everyone.

Let me clarify a couple of things as I think I have muddied the waters with my inarticulate descriptions

The steering only feels heavy when stationary in comparison to my modern BMW i.e. it takes significantly more effort to move the bars from side to side. I'll investigate the steering head bearing to eliminate that.

I dont have to consciously countersteer to get the bike to go into a turn, it is more that once the turn is initiated it feels like the front wheel would continue turning in (and eventually tuck under) if I didnt then apply active countersteering to correct this feeling. While being aware of this it doesnt make the bike unmanagable, because it is simple to factor this in to riding, sort of developing a Paso riding style. It does, however, make the handling feel anything but neutral in the early part of the turn. Once cruising around a curve the bike then feels vague and a bit 'detached' from the road, which I have put down to the old tyres. i certainly couldnt begin to contemplate booling up to a corner, chucking the bike in and scratching my way around it....which I CAN reasonably do on my R1200RT which is a WAY bigger tourer (acceptably albeit with modern tyres, great suspension, different wheel size, 15,000 miles of experience with it etc etc)

Dont get me wrong, my Paso is definitely growing on me. It is just am eager to make it better if possible, without losing the essential essence of the bike (it will never wear 17" wheels!) I think my next step has to be a 130/70 x 16 new front tyre

[higgy]

your there man !

Checking the steering head bearings is never a bad idea. Keep in mind on two wheels symptoms at the front are often a rear suspension issue,swing arm is after all in the 20 year old range.check the free play and the state of lubrication at both the swing arm and the shock and its linkage. Tire pressure will also have an effect at both ends

Old tires will certainly never be as good as new and the at least 7 year old now Michelin will never be an Avon or Bridgestone. Changing the aspect ratio and tread style will also have a noticeable effect on feel. But no matter where you end up on tires the 750/906Paso and Sport is never going to be the same feel as a 907 or a BMW. If that's what you are after the 907 would be a closer choice. Notice I did not say better. Better would be a preference only you can make. As you get more time on your Paso I think you find like a foot fungus it will grow on you as time goes by and you get more used to the feel. I for one always have a hard time deciding between my Paso's a 906 and 907 when it comes time to ride. Usually it come down to traffic and weather. If there is a lot of 4 or more wheeled donor makings out and about or it looks like wet roads I still can't make up my mind sometimes. The 907 all and all is a lot more forgiving when it comes to changing lines or having to brake hard cuz I'm too hot coming into decreasing radius and off camber corners unexpectedly. The one time I do prefer the 907 to the 906 is when I am riding in a group and I am not sure of the other riders. The reason for this is the 906 will require a different line than any other bike and when the group is shall we say more aggressive in nature and some fool might try to dip a wheel in on my space in a corner the 906 can be a handful. With experienced riders after the first series of tight corners it's never an issue, they always give me lots of space Then the fun begins in earnest

[Graemer57]

Higgy, I know what you mean about a Paso growing one you... I already think mine is actually making me a better rider.

The last 5 weeks have shown me that I've become a bit lazy (but not inattentive!) riding the Beemer. Great brakes (linked front and rear and working in good balance just off the hand lever), Telelever no dive forks, ABS, good tyres, the ability to change lines mid corner if required...when you add them together all these factors give you a greater margin of error and less need to be precise and, as it is only human nature, you find yourself accepting these benefits. Now, on the Paso, to ride smoother, faster, accurately, I have to put in more work and, when it all comes together, this is ultimately more satisfying. And I am now finding this translating back into riding the BMW.

I wouldnt for a second diss the benefits of modern machinery but in truth how many of us can truly use its full level of performance? Not me for sure.

but what really strikes me is how many riders of crotch-rockets are really missing out on a great experience by shunning older bikes in favour of the latest shiny missile.

Tell you what....shhhhhhh...... let's keep it as our secret,eh! That way we can keep having fun without it costing the earth

[higgy]

Tell you what....shhhhhhh...... let's keep it as our secret,eh! That way we can keep having fun without it costing the earth

I'm with you 100%
FYI,I intend to keep the weber as well...adds to the rogue Stallion appeal

[Fraser]

Graemer57,

You are on the right track. The Paso requires a planned approach to cornering and a thoughtful line taken. Dragging the rear brake slightly into the corner is very helpful.
So, after you have done your checking/maintenance etc you are likely to find the handling the same as before. Modern bikes make you a very lazy rider, my Suzuki GSX1200 has fantastic brakes, huge power, predictable handling and does not care how you approach a corner or get through it. Can't do that on the Paso 750, but it is very satisfying when it all come together. It is just familiarity and practice and you are already on the way. Stick to it.

Cheers,

Fraser.

[ducinthebay]

The Paso, like the Sport, is a very slow steering bike. That's not meant as bad, or good, it just is. Slow steering bikes don't change direction easily, which has its advantages, and disadvantages. In general, a slow steering bike feels much better at speed. If you have some nice fast sweepers, this bike is a dream. If you do around town stuff, you won't like it much. At speed, it is rock steady and seems to slows down time, while a quick steering bike will get fidgety at higher speeds. If you don't have the right roads to ride, you may never feel the magic of this bike.

Most of this characteristic is from the 16" low profile front tire. A narrow, taller tire will quicken up the steering, and feel more like a modern bike.

I traded bikes with a friend last year. They were both 1990 750 Sports with Dellorto and pipes. I had 17" wheels with 120/70 and 170/60. He had the stock tires. Amazing difference. The Sport, like the Paso, is a very stable bike at high speeds and shitty roads.

Its like skiing on big long boards. Super stable, doesn't turn quickly, and you need to plan your moves and hold to them.
Cheers,

[jayh]

I believe that the steering geometry of the Paso contributes to the handling issues probably equally as much as the wheel diameter(which of course is a part of that geometry).I recently purchased a 500 sl pantah,Wow what a difference to riding the Paso,the road felt like it had doubled in width,I felt completely at ease changing line during corners,I had forgotten just how demanding the Paso was to ride.I also have a 600 pantah which has had the upper frame members extended to rake the forks and decrease the wheel base by 50mm.The previous owner planned to race it.This bike behaves in a very similar manner to the Paso and MUST be ridden with counter steering through corners.It also has that nasty little tendency to tuck the front wheel in at low speeds.That is two identical bikes same tyres, same weights,just the fork rakes changed,one I would be happy to let my daughter learn on,the other I wouldn't trust my mates on. Keep at it .'After taming the beast grasshopper, you will feel completely at ease,a master of less fickle machines' All the best Jay.

[higgy]

jayh...absolutely geometry plays a part in the feel of the Paso It is just that the Michelins are the single biggest factor

Ducinthebay.... Once the suspension issues are dialed in they truly feel like they are on a rail

Graeme.... A better rider indeed We need a t-shirt "Paso 750/906 and the Sport" A Man's Bike In A Sea of Shit" to borrow a phrase

Fraser

The Paso requires a planned approach to cornering and a thoughtful line taken

I for one get the biggest kick out of these kinds of discussions

Duc750... just pullin your chain