Paso 750 Rear Tire solution (160/60/16)

[hardo]

@Ozpaso and @all: I decided to use the avons too. I posted some information in respect to this conversion here:

http://forums.ducatipaso.org/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=4463

Actually I am very happy with this combination.

@Kiwifruit: I would not use a 120/80 for the front wheel. The 150/80 is too small for the 5'' rim, but when using the 150/80 version we need to live with it. However, things do not get better if you use a tire that is too small in the front too (120/80: max 3''; the 750 sport has a 3,75' front wheel'). In addition: In a german speaking ducati forum (http://www.duc-forum.de), one guys comments on very odd behavior of the 750 sport when using the combinations you are talking about. More precisely, it seems to be quite easy to come to the edge of the tire when riding through curves (more important for the 750 sport, in case of the paso the side stand / exhausts etc. will touch the ground earlier). if you check the homepage of metzler

http://www.metzelermoto.com/web/default.page

for the 750 paso (wheel s are exactly the same), you get the following recommendation:

Sportec M3
Lasertec

Front Rear
130/70 ZR 16 M/C (61W) TL SPORTEC M3 Front 150/80 VB 16 M/C (71V) TL LASERTEC

Hence, why not spend some additional money and change the front tire to a sporttec M3? this is combination quite a lot of paso / 750 sport owners currently use.

All the best, Hardo

[kiwifruit]

I'm really pleased with the shape of the front (and rear). Both fitted up really well. Good matching curve.
The possibility of riding off the edge exists but i've no doubt this can be avoided by modifying one's body position (read; hang off like a monkey).

I looked at all the options inc the avons (too touring orientated). I wouldn't run a m3 with a me55, personally. Too much of a mismatch.

The bike will be on the road soon. I will keep you updated with how it goes.

[jayh]

Sorry it's taken so long Gert,My daughter called by to do some printing (my ink is cheaper) and now the scanner/copier/printer won't work at all ,of course she knows nothing about it ???? ,maybe just a fuse,I may have to hand type the Ohlins info. J.

[pasoalf]

Hi,
I’ve just to correct some earlier statement concerning the handling of the Avon Cobra.
I’m since 4000km on the road with Front: 130/70/16 (Metzeler Sportec) and rear: 180/60/16 (Avon Cobra). I mentioned earlier that the Handling is O.K. but meanwhile I’m loking for another solution.
I bought a 906 which still has an (“brandnew”). original tire . The guy who owned it before (a retired Ducati dealer) put some Michelins beside. Driving both bikes, I realized that the handling with the original tire (906) is far better. With the 750 (Avon Cobra) I have to push the inner handlebar quite strong to get it into the corner, and especially narrow corners are not easy to get (fast). Therfore I’m looking now for another solution. I just think that the design/shape of the Avon Cobra is to flat.
I’m searching now for a tire with a better (more circular shape). I think that this would solve the problem. I’ve seen that Pompone’s Shinko (see Page 1) has a very circular shape, no comparison with the Avon, which is really has a flat shape….. anyway this Shinko is not available any longer, and the replacement (Shinko SE890 is not yet available). Besides that I don’t know how this tire looks like. What I know is the old shinko tire a kind of Dunlop copy, but I don’t have any idea how the shape of the old Dunlop (D250) looks like. So to me it would bevery interesting in having some “original” Pictures’ of the available 180/60/16 tires (Dunlop D250; Dunlop Elite 3; Bridgestone G704)
pasoalf

[cellardoor]

Just replaced the original Rear Michelin m59 with a Metzeler 880 marathon and it fit great with no clearence issues and no chain tension issues. Moving the axle from the bottom of the swingarm to the top has eliminated most of height difference so the ride feels even better than the rear michelin did, i feel like i can lean harder into turns. Still riding a michelin a59 front. Thanks jayh for pointing out this tire, now i wonder about the other metzeler tires that fit for a front solution...

[pasoalf]

Hi,
Hi I just compared the shape of the original Michelin tire (on my 906) with the shape of the Avon Cobra which I ride already some time on the 750.
The result you find on the picture below. This explains why the handling with the Avon Cobra is so “shitty”(in comparison with the original Michelin). The tire itself isn’t bad (grip) but on a Paso it’s not a good solution. The shape /design is just to flat. In addition It’s with 186mm width almost a 190……. As I already mentioned I have to push always the inner handlebar to pass a corner.



Therefore I’m looking now for a different solution. As the Metzeler is not a radial I’ts no option for me.
If anybody could deliver me the shape of the Dunlop D250; Dunlop Elite 3; Bridgestone G704 (180/60/16) that would help me a lot

[cellardoor]

Dont know if this helps pasoalf but it says radial on it, I get a crude measure of 172mm width on this metzeler



aaand some more pics while i was at it....

[hardo]

yes, it is a radial tire, however, it is sold here as a special tiere for the gold wing 1800 and it may not be easy to good fit with a front tire

anyway, it is really nice, that it fits without modifications....quite hugh difference in size between the different 180 / 60 options o the market.

@pasoalf: we should meet next year somewhere in switzerland, you are more than welcome to test my avon azaro combination on my 906 and see (I think it is very good from the performance side and has an okay from the MFK), if you think this is better than your current combo

all the best, hardo

[jayh]

Nice looking bike cellardoor,the corbin seat looks good in blue too.I've done a few miles on the metzeler rear now and I'm really pleased with it,it's wearing very well.From the research I have done on them it appears its best to keep them inflated fairly high to keep the wear uniform ?? anyway,I've followed that advice and all is good.The only time I really have to work at countersteering the bike is hard cornering on tight hairpins,I don't consider this unusual though,just part of the challenge of owning / riding a paso. Jay.

[pasoalf]

@Cellardoor, thank‘s fort he input, up to now I did not consider the Metzeler as an option, but will have a look at it. The shape seems better than the shape of the Avon Cobra. But the carcass seems to me rather high.
From what I’ve seen so far Pompones Shinko had the best shape, but this one is not available anymore.
Anyway I’m still interested in the shape of the other tires.
@Hardo, we’ll manage that next summer

[paso750]

pasoalf could it be the combination with the Metzeler in front and is your axle position low or high ?

G.

[pasoalf]

Hi G.
The position of the axle is high, you can see on page 4 where I’ve put the pitchers.
I don’t’ think I’ts related to the front tire. The Metzeler Sportec is very circular. The Dunlop on the 906 looks similar. Until I had the direct comparison (with the original Michelin rear tire) I was not so unhappy with the Avon Cobra. But if you ride both bikes it’s a remarkable difference. There may be some differences (750-906; front tire) but that should not so much matter.
If you compare the shapes( I’ve taken them with wires, they're accurate) then it's obvious you get the bike much easier around the corner with the original Michelin. And as I said, in narrow corners I have to push the inner Handlebar quite hard to get the Avon around….

[paso750]

While a narrow tire handles better than a wide one there`s always a relation with the front tire used, tire pressures and the bikes suspension & steering setup. You should meet up with hardo and swap front wheels for a try. The high axle position will also impact handling as it lowers the rear and influences the steering angle. I`d try that in standard bottom position.

G.

[pasoalf]

I last week visited a Honda Goldwing dealer just to take a look at the different 180/60/16 tire options.
I measured them and took the shape of them.
The results you see just below.



Considering the Shape of the tire, Dunlop Elite seems to be the best available option concerning handling. But I’m more and more thinking about moving to the 150/80/16.
I’ ve also sent an Email to shinko, just to know as of when the SE890 is available (could possibly also be an option)
Besides that I’ve summarized all the available information about the different tires:

[jayh]

Metzeler me 880 615 diameter 174.5 width (174),measured with calipers and tape measure.As fitted to Oscam rim,so you can update your chart.Great Idea J.