Can we get a new manufacturer for 16" tires???

[paso750]

I checked it. The models mentioned used the same tires. Other F1 models had different 16" sizes, that`s right.

[spaynenda]

It's purely a business decision, and since the production volumes are so low, JC's approach makes the most sense.

Perhaps if we could encourage a specialist manufacturer, e.g. Avon/Cooper, to deal directly with Pirelli or Michelin for access to their old molds, with the offer to preserve their original name on the side as an inducement to cooperate, they might agree.

If I'm not mistaken, though, the problem only exists for '86 ~ '88 750 Pasos (130/60x16 front, 160/60x16 rear), as the later models were upgraded to 17 inch wheels, yes?

[mike]

the greatest argument for keeping these tires produced are the countries that require the oem size in order to pass inspection. these folks, no matter what they do, are simply devoid of all options now that these tires are no longer produced.

[persempre907]

If I'm not mistaken, though, the problem only exists for '86 ~ '88 750 Pasos (130/60x16 front, 160/60x16 rear), as the later models were upgraded to 17 inch wheels, yes?

It's not so. All the 750/906 have same tires.

the greatest argument for keeping these tires produced are the countries that require the oem size in order to pass inspection. these folks, no matter what they do, are simply devoid of all options now that these tires are no longer produced.

The problem is above all for Italy, where there is the greatest number of those bikes (I guess) and our laws don't allow any change from the homologation fiche.

No matter, many guys do change their wheels, mufflers, etc. but they risk fines and insurance problems in case of accident.

In the other EU countries there isn't the same problem (like in Germany....).

Ciao

[JWilliam]

I had changed the swingarm of my 906 to accept a different tyre because I was annoyed by the tyre industry and its refusal to make this tyre. If we were charged more for this fitment we would pay it but to refuse to make the suitable tyre regardless of cost is more akin to industrial action. I would have expected some type of legal action against companies Michelin or Pirelli because if we were informed about this tyre shortage before we purchased the machines then I expect the total Ducati sales would have been much reduced. In the UK we can fit a non standard tyre but it is a disgrace that our friends of Italy and Germany suffer this indignation and goes against the spirit of the European Union (if that is what the European Union actually means).

[duke900]

if michelin or pirelli or other manufaturers see the price the last 130/60r16 and 160/60r16 are being sold, maybe they would change their ideias......and make this sizes once again....

i would not pay 300$ or more for a rear tire....

but will pay more than the cost of a 180/55r17 top range.....

just to keep my paso runing.....

sorry for bad english

[Finnpaso]

I checked it. The models mentioned used the same tires. Other F1 models had different 16" sizes, that`s right.

750 F1 1985: "wheels were gold painted Oscam (not same Oscams as Pasos use!!!), an MT 2.50 X 16-inch on the front fitted with 120/80V16 A48 Michelin tire. The rear MT 3.00 X 18-inch was shod with a 130/80V18 M48 Michelin....." Michelin 48 was totally different tire! While the F1 continued with a 2.5 x 16" front wheel, the Montjuich came with a lighter 3.5 x 16" Marvic / Akront composite front wheel. Rear: 4.25 X 16" In Montjuich they used Michelin INTERMEDIATE RACING TIRES, a 12/60-16 and 18/67-16

Lacuna Seca use Paso wheels. These were wider: 3.75 X 16" in front and 5.00 X 16" in rear (Paso wheels!)

In Santa Monica they started to use again those same Marvic 2 composite wheels, as in Montjuich (same diameters!)

About Bimota DB1 wheels: 3.25 x 16" in front and 4.25 x 16" in rear, (another, than in Paso!)

[paso750]

Antti,

read correctly. I did not list "F1", but only F1 Laguna Seca and Santamonica. Although the Santamonica used Acront rims according to Ian Fallon "The production Santamonica also came with with braided brake lines. Tires were Michelin radials in the same sizes as the Laguna Seca"
(the Santamonica didn`t come with race intermediates like the Montjuich)

The DB1 according to my infos indeed uses different size rims, but it still did use the same tire sizes. (the info comes from an old german magazine test Paso vs. DB1 vs. F1)
It`s about bikes using same tire size, not same rim sizes.

G.

[paso750]

In the UK we can fit a non standard tyre but it is a disgrace that our friends of Italy and Germany suffer this indignation

Actually it seems the issue is mainly in Italy. We here in Germany can get a permission to use different wheels or tires, but this needs to be approved by the TÜV (vehicle inspection dept.) and then officially documented in the vehicle`s papers. Of course you have to pay for that.

G.

[persempre907]

In Germany you're lucky.
Here in Italy it's quite impossible.
Ciao

[Finnpaso]

Antti,

read correctly. I did not list "F1", but only F1 Laguna Seca and Santamonica. Although the Santamonica used Acront rims according to Ian Fallon "The production Santamonica also came with with braided brake lines. Tires were Michelin radials in the same sizes as the Laguna Seca"

I think, that Santa Monicas (and Montjuich) came with totally different tires(needeed to those Akrot rims!!!!), than Paso tires... Braided lines are not connected to this thing....All those, who have those 2 composite wheels, cant use normal 16" Michelins, OR if they use them, then that tire DONT FIT PERFECT to that Akront rim, what needs totally different tire...(Surely someone put such 16" Michelin to such rim...hahahahaha....but those are in my level very low...) Allways tire MUST FIT TO rim !!!

Original Lacuna Seca use same rims/wheels/tires, as Pasos use...(comfirmed just from my close fried, who have Lacuna Seca), no matter he have those 2 composite rims, when he drive races in Europe race tracks....But that was HIS MODIFICATION to better handling/less mass in rims, etc... whatever those racing guys are talking about....

Santa Monica had to use different tires, than Pasos with those 2 composite rims.... i stay in this100%...

[Finnpaso]

In Germany you're lucky.
Here in Italy it's quite impossible.
Ciao

Here in Finland we can put whatever tires to rims, cause no anykind of "year check" yet for motorbikes.... And polices dont have time to check "tires sizes" in streets at all... they have to go to see, who killed who with guns in schools..... "small america" here, what i HATE ALOT.......

[paso750]

I pass. I can only quote what Ian Fallon wrote in his books.
btw I found this also http://www.pantah.eu/sites/technik/daten.htm
and http://www.pantah-club.com/data/ducati_pantah__spec.htm and
http://www.pantah.eu/bilder_prospekte/DB1/db1_2.jpg ...
I guess we should differ bikes that originally used the same tire sizes as the Paso as I`ve listed them and bikes that originally use the same tire sizes but would probably do better with other tires due to different rim sizes what is that you are talking about, Antti. Can we agree on that ?
After all it`s just a list that should help to emphasize the argumentation that we`re not the only ones needing these tires.

[Jaffa]

Hey guys,

I hate to be the bearer of bad news, but perhaps its time to face the reality of not being able to get these tyres anymore, and just making the mods necessary to bring your old bangers into the new world of motorcycling?

[cagiva905]

I know I am now going to be considered as a blasphemist, but what about checking into the possibilities (both financial and (more important) technical, of recovering used tires with a new surface?
I have sufficient technical background to be serious in this. Although I have no first hand experience with it, I do know this technology has improved immensely over the years, and perhaps a specialist would be interested in looking in to this.
I know recovering tuck & car tires is done in the US and in the UK at least, so perhaps one of the readers from that area are willing to contact businesses in this field.
Although currently not owning a Paso, I know I would have not too much problem with such a tire to keep my classic on the road for years to come, given the quality of the tire job was satisfactory.